Gustatus Similis Pullus ([info]dazed1) wrote,
@ 2008-02-27 09:07:00
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don't I ever shut up?
Al Gore has done more damage to environmentalism than anyone else on Earth ever has, in the history of mankind. Why? He lead a successful movement in thinking that "global warming" was occurring due to human activity, and not only is he a hypocrite ($500 of nat gas/month to heat his pool, very non-green habits), he's patently wrong. And in being wrong, he will turn off people to the idea of caring, because they now associate being green merely with preventing global warming, instead of associating it with, well, just doing what one should. Damnit.

Why he gets a free pass for looking at just a few short years and then extrapolating that out is beyond me. "But the difference between 1998 and 1908 was vast!" well, ok, but how about 1996, 1997, 1999, or 2008? It is beyond question that proponents of the "man-made global warming" scare cherry-pick years to prove a point, instead of looking at trends.

Fav quote from the above article:
God, people like you make me tired. So every commenter on this thread is a scientific illiterate, except you? OK, so I'm a lowly historian and you're a chemist. Fine. Let me tell you what I do know, friend.
I know that a diagram (Mann's discredited "hockey stick") that wipes out a three-hundred year historical reality, the Medieval Warming Period, is patently fraudulent. I know that when I see a goofball described as a "leading climatologist" spouting the insane proposition that the infancy of industrialization is what ended the Little Ice Age, I am watching a political hack with zero credibility. I know that when a petition supporting global warming is presented with 4000 names and half of those names are not scientists, that science had little or nothing to do with it. And I know that when the gears start switching to "Climate Change" instead of "Global Warming," the wheels are coming off the bus.
I further know that politicizing science in the name of a concept as undefined as "social justice" is a crime against both science and history.


So do people not notice the shift? That we're no longer hearing "global warming" but instead "global climate change?" And do people really not know that all evidence prior to the AlGore movement pointed to global cooling?

Clean up the air, and the environment, because it is dirty, not because it may or may not be warming something! You don't clean the dishes because you think they'll get hotter if you don't, right? Do you like the idea of living in a pile of trash? Then recycle, and buy green products! Do you like the idea of breathing toxic fumes? Then stop driving SUVs and wasting electricity! Don't do it because AlGore said the planet is warming, do it because you should. Where were your mothers, damnit!



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[info]princessdiablo
2008-02-27 06:02 pm UTC (link)


http://www.switched.com/2007/12/19/high-school-teachers-global-warming-video-a-youtube-hit/

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[info]dazed1
2008-02-27 10:08 pm UTC (link)
flaws:
1) he keeps interchanging "global warming" with "global climate change," which was sortof my point ;) Its bad to do that. I'm not arguing A v B.
2) at 1:58, a serious logic flaw; he suggests that since "no one can be sure with absolute certainty what the physical world will do" that row A and B are equal. That is an absurd argument. He later suggests greys exist between colms A and B, but never lets go of that
3) A2 has the same costs as A1. While he wrote "cost" in A2, he sugar coated it. This is important, because if you choose colm A, you will have heavy costs involved, whereas if you choose column B, you might not. More importantly, it is possible to determine if, in B, there will be costs.
4) B2 is false on many levels; an increase of a few degrees over current temps has been shown to have historically improved the overall livability of the planet. He also lists many things that are the same - Soc? Pol? That is the same thing. Adding redundant bullet points proves nothing.
5) A1 (and potentially A2, if critics are right) is the *same* as B2. Reason is, there will be countries that enact changes (the US has been much better about it than they are given credit for) and countries that don't (China already pollutes more than the US, yet their GDP is far lower). We don't live in a world with a single government - we can't assume black/white. China et. al will continue making things as cheaply as they possibly can, and no one will be able to compete with them on price. Severe Global Depression also means countries will go to war over limited resources. Political structures will collapse. The env will get worse as we have to go back to more primative methods for things (coal is nice and cheap, and highly available. Depression = more pollution).

Its silly for him to say no one has been able to poke a single hole in it. I also don't think you really read my post, because I said it doesn't matter either way as well - but not for the reason he gave. The reason he gives is like the strange argument that some Christians give of "what if I'm right and you're wrong? You'll be in hell forever!" That's a silly argument. Silly. What is even sillier is using extremes that rational scientists know aren't possible.

GCC != GW, and the terms should stop being used interchangeably.
We should clean up after ourselves (which won't cause a global depression). We should do it because we don't want to live in a smelly, trashy place.

And people who spend $500/month to heat their pool should not be considered environmentalists.

(Reply to this) (Parent)


[info]dazed1
2008-02-27 10:31 pm UTC (link)
btw - it's not an unimportant difference, due to the point I was trying to make.

People look around right now and /don't/ see global warming. So they think they don't need to do anything, because they feel the scare-mongers were wrong. Worse, there's a /lot/ of scientific evidence that there will continue to be global cooling, and what then?

People are dumb, and will just become cynical of environmentalism. Why? Because when everyone else was warning about global cooling, but independent of that was saying people should clean up the air and recycle, some strange nut came along and said it was global /warming/ we needed to worry about. And that nut got listened to. The fact that he was, hurts the progress and trends that were occurring before he said anything about the issue. Had he never championed the cause of global warming, I'm arguing, we would be in a better position right now to convince people to live more environmentally-friendly lives.

But I do a considerable amount in my life to live green - not for GW prevention, but because one /should/ do such. Just, /should/. I cause less pollution in *total* than he causes just to heat his pool. He's damaged the cause.

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